Arkashean Q&A Session -- 027

JACKEY: Hello? It's recording.

THERRY: It doesn't matter how truthful they are, how false they are; they're based on the information that you possess at the time. And because you possess that information at the time, those feelings are going to come around inside of you. Then it's a matter of investigating why you feel like you do based on the information that you have. Then you investigate your level of truth and your rewards, and that will give you the information of where you should make the changes.

JONZIE: There's an unfortunate aspect of that because seemingly you can also have those negative at-work dealings and the reason could be an error in your logic process.

THERRY: Yes. That happens to be part of the road that mortal man may not walk alone.

JACKEY: But can't that bias the way that you feel sometimes?

THERRY: It will always bias it, because that's part of the road that you can't walk alone. How can you, by yourself, of yourself, change something that you don't know needs to be changed because you're caught in your own illusions?

JACKEY: Well, you feel it.

THERRY: All you feel is that you don't feel right, but you can't say why. For instance, let's take you as an individual. When you have a feeling that something's not right, and if I were to ask you what is not right, can you answer me?

JACKEY: Sometimes.

THERRY: Really? All right, let's choose one. Choose one; let's talk about it.

JACKEY: Okay, um, alright, well let's say I'm involved with somebody that I know inside is not somebody that I want to end up spending my whole life with, but I'm just spending some time with.

THERRY: And you end up feeling empty inside.

JACKEY: And you feel, when you look at that person, even though you've been honest with them, and it doesn't matter, just the fact that you're physically with them makes you feel wrong; it feels wrong to be with them.

THERRY: Then why be with them?

JACKEY: Um, well, needs. Well, you like the person, you like being with them, you're just not making a commitment.

THERRY: Then since you've already accepted that, why feel bad? See what I mean, can't answer me. There's a reason for it, but you yourself do not know what it is, because it is part of your illusion, it's part of your make-up.

JACKEY: Well, what is the reason?

THERRY: Because there's an inequality there someplace. Somewhere within your illusion you have an inequality that just doesn't add up. It's based on mis-information; corrupt information, corrupt values, and you can't find it by yourself because all you see is your own reflection of what is; you can't see pass the illusion.

JACKEY: So that's why we need to look into the mirror?

THERRY: Yea. See, you proved the point for me quite easily.

DUNCAN: I'd be interested in finding out the errors. Let's say you're trying to go celibate, so you think you're not supposed to masturbate, but you do anyway, and you constantly find yourself at war. Is it an error in your logic process, or are you doing something wrong and you should stop?

THERRY: You're dealing with a whole new range now. Now you're dealing with the number one strongest urge that exists upon the planet's illusions.

DUNCAN: So the pattern's no longer the same?

THERRY: No, you're dealing with sex now. That's the number one biggest, strongest thing that exists on earth.

DUNCAN: Well I would say it's the number one biggest strongest pattern I can see where I'm constantly at war with myself.

THERRY: Yea, that's because there's duality involved there. It's one thing from logic's point when you're not caught in the throngs of libido to make a decision; it's something else when the energies inside of you start changing.

JONZIE: So you're saying that sex is the strongest drive?


JONZIE: Go on!

THERRY: To give you an example of how strong it is, there are some species who actually knowingly commit suicide for the sake of having sex.

JACKEY: On this planet?

THERRY: Sure. Drones, for instance. They know well ahead of time that once they mate with the queen, they're going to have their nuts ripped out and they're going to die. They know this, but that's their only being for living. So that's one hell of an orgasm!

JACKEY: I'll say.

JONZIE: So they can't like just sit in a corner and masturbate.

THERRY: Um-um. That's not within their illusion.

CORA: Is it, getting back to humans within celibacy, isn't it okay to masturbate because the natural process of going celibate is that you'll want to do it eventually less and less and less?

THERRY: Well, there are different trains of thought on that.

CORA: What's Arkashea's train of thought on that?

THERRY: Arkashea doesn't have one.

DUNCAN: Whole can of worms.

THERRY: Arkashea wouldn't dream of putting the label `normal' on anything, because truth itself is so relative, how can you say what is the norm?


Well, Arkashea has a cloister, and in the cloister people take their vows of celibacy, and obviously these people haven't been celibate all their lives, most of them, so what's the pattern for celibacy that's also within the realms for celibacy for Arkashea within the cloister, an okayness?

THERRY: Well, first of all, you have to understand that celibacy's a state of mind far more than it's an abstinence of behavior, so that by the time you get to that state, the needs of the body is less of an influence than your Maat. If you're in the Hamlet and the needs or the cry of the wild is stronger than the need for celibacy, obviously you don't gyrate towards the cloister, you become a dancer.

JACKEY: You just gyrate.

THERRY: Right. (laughter)

DUNCAN: So what about --

CORA: But it seems incongruous to be at war all the time if you're going celibate.

THERRY: Well, at the cost of contradicting myself, it's normal because, to make the statement of an individual who is at peace with himself, and at the same time to make the statement that you're talking about man, that's a contradiction in terms.

CORA: Okay, I know somebody else who's trying to go celibate, and they masturbate a whole lot, and they don't have a problem with it; they're not at war with it at all because they just feel that it's a natural process of going celibate, and that eventually --

THERRY: So that's their trade-off.

CORA: But is it true? For the pattern of celibacy, is it true that masturbation--

THERRY: Are you asking for a blanket statement, or are you asking for--

CORA: It's different for everybody.

THERRY: You got it. It's based on the illusion.

CORA: You change your illusion by updating information, right?


DUNCAN: I have a question. Does that constant state of conflict serve any useful purpose or is it a big waste of time?

THERRY: It's the driving force for the illusion.

JACKEY: It's resolving those conflicts that allow you to grow, I imagine, or is part of the growth process.


DUNCAN: Well, obviously it doesn't have to be, does it. You don't have to have that I would--

THERRY: Well, that's debatable considering that on this level it's a case of you must play games. And I don't know of any individuals part of man who does play the game of complete homeostasis. He would be viewed as an awfully dull person.

DUNCAN: But he'd have peace!

THERRY: Yea, six feet under.

CORA: Well, I don't know if they can. Change is constant, how can a human being be at total homeostasis?

THERRY: That's why I say it's a contradiction in terms.

DUNCAN: I'll take fifty percent.

THERRY: (chuckles) Do I hear sixty?

CORA: It just seems to me as an individual, and I know this may be different for other people, but if I was going to go celibate, well, I won't go into personal things, it just seems to me that over time, as your mind and spiritual things get stronger, the desire even to masturbate gets less and less, so it seems like it's a natural process. You may get horny sometimes but still the desire comes less; it becomes less frequent until eventually it's just not there as much because it's a matter of time and training and natural process instead of having a war with `I shouldn't do it when I'm horny', or is that not true?

THERRY: It's not true.

CORA: It's not true.

THERRY: It's going to depend upon your system of rewards.

CORA: What do you mean, your system of rewards?

THERRY: Everybody commits a behavior for a special reason; they want the reward that the behavior brings, and if your system of rewards is incongruent with your Maat, then you can sit and claim celibacy until the cows come home and you're going to be masturbating until eternity ends.

CORA: Is masturbation not part of celibacy?

THERRY: Are you asking for a blanket statement?

CORA: I'm asking for a pattern.

THERRY: That question doesn't lie within patterns.

CORA: It's strictly individual?

THERRY: Strictly individual, like anything else.

CORA: Because I always understood that physiologically the body has needs, and so the body's going to take care of those needs. I thought celibacy was devoting yourself to say the Universe and Arkashea.

THERRY: If the body can take care of its needs, and if the mind is developed such that it is the greater control over the needs of the body, then the sexual needs of the body can be transmitted in a different way; they can be re-channeled; that energy can be used in other ways.

CORA: That's the point of celibacy, isn't it?


CORA: That's the purpose of it?

THERRY: That's the process, that's not a point.

JACKEY: Is that a necessary process in order to evolve.

THERRY: That depends on the individual, yes.

DUNCAN: Are there any patterns that can be used so that the individual can become more at greater peace with himself, or is that something that has to be done at an individual level?

THERRY: That's something that has to be done on an individual level simply because of the Maat of the individual involved. They have specific value systems and they have a very specific scale of what is right and what is wrong; they can't get away from that scale.

JONZIE: So the answer --let's say all five of us are normally going through that process--

THERRY: If you have five people in the room, you're going to have about ten or eighteen different reasons for doing things because to say that you know exactly what you feel and to say that you're man, again it's inconsistent.

JACKEY: To say what?

THERRY: That you know exactly what you feel.


THERRY: And to say that you're man. Man never knows exactly what he feels; it's inconsistent.

CORA: It's ambivalence.

THERRY: There's always ambivalence because over time you keep changing.

CORA: But is ambivalence a law? Does there have to be ambivalence there?

THERRY: It's part of the game of illusions; that is the reason why the only thing that is constant is change.

CORA: So then yes, there does have to be ambivalence.

THERRY: Yes, it's part of the laws of illusion. That's the flux.

JACKEY: So what exactly is the advantage of--say you want to go celibate but you find yourself in sexual desires, so you masturbate. What's the advantage of masturbating and then having sexual relations with somebody who mutually understands the fact that this is just a sexual relationship?

THERRY: Well, there's a whole scheme of things there. Again, it gets back to the system of rewards. For some people, using others as a tool of masturbation gives them a greater illusion which drives them closer into Earth, which drives them further away from the purity of celibacy. For some others, they have the illusion that masturbation doesn't bring another individual into it, and therefore the illusion is more pure. Whatever works.

DUNCAN: So what happens, or what can be said for the individual who basically in his own illusion has no problem with his body; the whole problem is in his mind; not controlling his body at all.

THERRY: There's no perfection on Earth. Everything takes time.

CORA: So would the war come from trying to be a perfectionist?

THERRY: Yea, war comes because of the inappropriate expectations and demands.

CORA: On yourself.

THERRY: Yes. Or upon the situation or upon others. In either case, because there is war, Maat is not honored.

CORA: I wouldn't think so. It would defeat the purpose of celibacy to always be at war because of it.


CORA: So, giving a philosophy understand, forgive, and love, can you just, or gentle with yourself, masturbated when you felt like it, time would take care of it, wouldn't it?


DUNCAN: Sure, and then you masturbate six times a day, whenever you feel like it. (laughter)

THERRY: What difference does it make if you masturbate six times a day but you're at peace, you're a whole lot better off then if you don't masturbate and that's the only thing that runs through your mind.

DUNCAN: Sure, but the end result is are you really going to be at peace if you masturbate six times a day either.

THERRY: That all depends on your system of rewards, doesn't it?

DUNCAN: I guess so.

JACKEY: So really it all comes down to the individual and how the individual feels within himself, what he's doing.

THERRY: Um-hum. Yes.

DUNCAN: What if the individual feels like he's damned if he doesn't and damned if he does?

THERRY: That's a good game to play; you can have a lot of fun with that.

CORA: That's your own level of observation, you can change.

DUNCAN: It's very easy to say --

THERRY: Well not everybody can change their level of observation. Sometimes Karma forbids a change because you have to experience certain things.

DUNCAN: It's one thing to know logically that you can change. It's another to have the emotions holding you in the situation.

CORA: Okay, I can accept that, but isn't he having his war because of his expectations of what it is to be celibate and his--

THERRY: What difference does that make to the individual who can't change it?

CORA: How can you not be able to change it if you make those realizations?

THERRY: Because there's a difference between knowing something and realizing it.

CORA: So then he doesn't realize it, because if he realized it it would change.

THERRY: Not necessarily so. Just because you have a brain, there's no guarantee you're going to use it.

DUNCAN: Isn't there also a possibility, not necessarily in my case, but that there's other unknown aspects affecting the individual.

THERRY: Yea, but her assumption is that you have realization; that means there is no unknown. Just because a person knows the difference between right and wrong, that doesn't guarantee they're going to choose right.

JACKEY: I guess then that there is no right and wrong, just appropriate and inappropriate.

THERRY: True, but right and wrong means appropriate for you within that given situation. It's an axiom within the conversation.

JACKEY: So it's right or wrong according to your own value systems.

THERRY: Correct.

JACKEY: So within yourself you can turn a right or wrong situation.

THERRY: Most people think they can, but they usually corrupt themselves and therefore they don't know what the difference is anymore. They trade-off.

CORA: Strictly speaking, right and wrong has to be referenced to a goal, right?


CORA: And if you have a goal and you follow a recipe, then that is right for the recipe, so that is right for you.


CORA: And doing something against the recipe is considered wrong, strictly speaking.


CORA: Even if that goal was to be a Nazi. If you followed the recipe to do that, then that's right for that individual, for the goal, right?


CORA: But then you get away from the thing you were talking about last night of the absolute right which exists higher up where that person's going to have more pain the further he gets from that say called absolute right.

THERRY: That means now you've changed your reference point. Right and wrong now have different meanings.

CORA: Oh, okay, so it changes levels.

THERRY: Right. See, that's where the problems are with language. There are some words that of themselves, they're meaningless; they require a scale of reference. The words right and wrong happen to be two of those words. The definition is totally dependant on the scale of reference that you're using. Does that answer your question?

JACKEY: Um, forgot the question. But, no, it answered things.

DUNCAN: So what I can understand from my situation, if I understand correctly, is that I have knowledge but not wisdom.

THERRY: In some areas.

DUNCAN: All I can see is that I Just constantly go around in circles.


DUNCAN: I'm getting like a rat in one of those little cages, I'm spinning my wheels, ain't getting anywhere quick!

JACKEY: Hey Therry, in reference to some of the stuff we were talking about last night, when you start out in Orthodontiks and then you descend and when you're in Orthodontiks you have all the wisdom you're ever going to have, does that imply that wisdom is not something that is ever gained, or like, you don't gain any new wisdom through living, you just--I mean, you end up back, you know, let's say you go through your whole cycle, you're back there at Orthodontiks after descending; you have the same wisdom you had when you started. That means that this whole cycle, you don't gain wisdom.

THERRY: Um, in order to answer that, we first have to have some definitions.

JACKEY: Okay, of wisdom?

THERRY: No, game. If you strictly use the definition game according to Webster's dictionary, then from one level, that is true, you never gain anything, but from another level, yes you do gain something. Once you descend, and the veils of forgetfulness take control, from that point you no longer possess certain wisdom, and the process of living, you gain or regain that wisdom. So, from that point of view, yea, you gained it. But from the point of view of before having descended, you had it anyway, so from that sense, no, you haven't gained anything. You simply regained it.

JACKEY: You regain what you already had, but you don't actually add any new wisdom.

THERRY: That depends on what level you're talking about. Again, you have to bear in mind that you're trying to understand a level that is outside the bounds of illusions by using the tools of illusions which of course is absurd.

JACKEY: So, while in the illusion of Earth, or while on earth, you are in fact gaining wisdom in the sense that as veils get lifted you start recognizing more and more of the wisdom that already exists.

THERRY: From that level, you are gaining, but from the ultimate level, you're only regaining.

JACKEY: So then what is the distinction between knowledge and wisdom? Is knowledge just something that exists on a physical level on earth, or is knowledge--

THERRY: Um, man lives, or experiences on different levels at the same time. Knowledge is that which belongs to intelligence only.

JACKEY: And intelligence can only exist through a medium like the brain is your intelligence?

THERRY: No, that's one way of looking at it. Wisdom is more rounder, more full; it is the combination of the union of all levels of man. Knowledge allows you to look at a pattern; wisdom allows you to adapt that pattern to all situations up to and including the veils which border illusions. Whereas knowledge is just a classical sense.

JACKEY: Well do you take knowledge with you as you ascend?

THERRY: No, knowledge stays behind.

JACKEY: So is it just kind of a twirl that you have to play with?

THERRY: No, it's a tool.

CORA: A tool to gain wisdom.

THERRY: Yea, it's a short term memory device.

JACKEY: So it's a tool in order to help remove some of the veils.

THERRY: Yes. Knowledge is different for each life-cycle, and each level of life-cycle.

JACKEY: So when you die after one particular life-cycle, and you're not really ready to ascend back to Orthodontiks; you're going to come back and do another life. Do you take some of the knowledge that you gained from the previous life with you?


JACKEY: All you take is that same wisdom-

THERRY: Whatever wisdom you've gained.

JACKEY:--that same veil of wisdom, but the veils that you removed using the knowledge that you gained in a lifetime, you removed x veils--


JACKEY: Those x veils are still removed when you come back.

THERRY: As potentials.

JACKEY: As potentials that you --when you go to the next life.

THERRY: Yea. Once you get into your next life, they come to you in terms of inner feelings, inner knowings, like you just know something, you don't know why you do, you just know it. It's part of your Maat; unshakable. And even though the tool of knowledge of that level may deny that wisdom, you will deny the tool of knowledge rather then deny the knowings. That's like in a certain century, the dominant religion preached that the Earth is the center and everything revolves around. Well other life-forms just knew that that was not correct. They just knew it, and that's what they followed, `cause that was wisdom.

JACKEY: So is wisdom some kind of an ultimate truth?

THERRY: That's one way of explaining it, yea. Other people may use the phrase `it is a more perfect truth.' To each their own.

JACKEY: Does each individual have their own wisdom?


JACKEY: Does it--are they different?

THERRY: Can be; doesn't have to be.

CORA: You said before that truth was relative. If you describe wisdom as a more perfect form of truth, does that mean that wisdom is relative too?

THERRY: No, it's not as relative.

CORA: `Cause I thought wisdom was more consistent even to that level.

THERRY: It is, but it's still not perfect because it's based upon the individual's illusion so it too is corrupted.

JACKEY: Wisdom is corrupted? Or the illusion of wisdom?

THERRY: No, the individual's illusions are corrupted.

JACKEY: But wisdom never changes.

THERRY: But the wisdom that the individual possesses is based on his illusions. And therefore there is a degree of corruption.

CORA: Because it's imperfect, right?

THERRY: Right.

CORA: `Cause you don't understand totally every concept of the thing that you're wise about.

THERRY: Right, you just feel.

JACKEY: But that's not really the wisdom itself, that's just the wisdom that you have gained access to by removing some of the veils.

THERRY: But it's still wisdom from your point; that's how you interact with that wisdom. You have to interact with wisdom based on your illusion.

JACKEY: Yea but the wisdom itself, at least from what you said before, the wisdom itself never changes. It was pure when it started; it gets veiled--

THERRY: That's not part of our conversation. The conversation is about how each individual perceives, and how each individual reacts or interacts with whatever. And it's based on their illusion.


CORA: `Cause everything's based on illusion as long as there's a physical body.

THERRY: You got it. It's a fabric.

CORA: So until you're back in Deluge, you're not gonna have perfect wisdom because you're still going to have some sort of illusion, right?

THERRY: Perhaps that's the reason why we say there's no perfection on Earth. `Cause everything's based on illusion.

CORA: So you might always be missing even the tiniest piece of information which would make what you said accurate, all the way up to Deluge.


CORA: And because Deluge is out of illusion, out of Maya.


line; mso-bidi-font-weight: E'EBAR : I have a question. Is the degree of wisdom on the planet limited by the illusions of the entire species?


normal; layout-grid-mode: E'EBAR : So could we hope to gain more wisdom?

THERRY: On an individual basis, yeah; as a species, no.

JACKEY: And is the species as a whole evolving?


JACKEY: So there might be a time where the species as a whole will be more in tune with that wisdom.


DUNCAN: Can I ask you a question if I recall something. So you're saying that for the species as a whole, they do not hope to gain more wisdom. And yet, if I understand correctly, if the species does evolve, that will allow the individual himself, possibly to have more wisdom.

THERRY: It's the other way around. The individual will gain more wisdom before the species will. As more and more individuals evolve, that is what makes the species evolve.

CORA: That's why you say people can only change one by one.


CORA: It's like the process of studying with you; you have a group a students, but the species doesn't necessarily have access to you or the stuff that you know.

THERRY: Correct.

DUNCAN: Then I don't understand why you say there's no hope for the species to gain more wisdom.

THERRY: Because it's based upon the limitations of the individuals.

DUNCAN: Wait a minute. If each individual has the potential to gain more wisdom, shouldn't it then follow that the species has the potential to gain more wisdom?


DUNCAN: Then where am I making my mistake?

THERRY: Your mistake is made because of the assumption that strictly because the individual has the capability, that means they will.

DUNCAN: When you say there's no hope --

THERRY: Based on the pattern. If ninety-nine percent of the individual choose Earth and the games of earth, that's not saying a hell of a lot for the species.

JACKEY: Can you as an individual help affect change?


JACKEY: By setting examples --


JACKEY: By spreading or by helping to you know, not force a message down someone's throat but just by setting an example so people might see that and say hey--

THERRY: Yes, but you can only do that on a one to one basis.

JACKEY: Well if you have a medium in which to reach a lot of people, can't you do that on a larger scale? Like music for instance?

THERRY: If that were true, why hasn't change already come? I mean, with all of the evangelists that are preaching do right, do that, do this--

JACKEY: Well they're full of shit.

THERRY: What's the difference? The supposed message that they preach is not supposed to be full of shit. I mean they are constantly constantly preaching love thy neighbor, forgive, don't do harm. And they turn around and do the exact opposite.

CORA: Is this whole thing because there are certain paths mortal man cannot walk alone?

THERRY: You got it.

CORA: Therefore, if someone just preaches a philosophy, that's not retracing any of their steps to get them out of the pain that they're in, to reduce any Karma--

THERRY: Nobody's listening. They just view that as one more business proposal which is absurd.

CORA: They're also trapped in their own pain; they can't get any understanding because they're just trapped in their own illusion.

THERRY: They don't want any. It's not that they can't get any, they don't want any.

JACKEY: It seems to me as though they want some kind of a shortcut.

THERRY: You just hit the biggest nail that there is.

JACKEY: There are no shortcuts.

THERRY: There are no shortcuts, and they're saying--

JACKEY: These guys are saying hey, we've got a shortcut.

THERRY: Yeah, that other shmuck did it for us, so we don't have to be responsible any more; we can sit about raping, pillaging, war, but it doesn't matter because he did it for us.

JACKEY: You mean Jesus?

THERRY: Right. So, what does that leave for the species? That's the biggest harm that Christianity has done.

JACKEY: They say, hey this is a shortcut to the gates of heaven; just believe--

THERRY: Right, just believe. Go out and kill, find any nigger you can and hang him. Doesn't matter. You believe in me, you're going to go to heaven. I mean, there's something lacking in that logic. Then they'll turn around and every Saturday or Sunday, or whatever, they'll come, `love your neighbor, do good for evil, turn the other cheek', then they'll get out of the doors and they go off to a bar and they go off hunting, and they go off, you know, there's something lacking in that logic. I would say that their Maat is slightly tarnished. I would even go so strong as to say that their halo has become a noose or a leash, and it is the preacher that holds the other end of the leash. I mean, it's absurd, and on the basis of that you'll say that the species has a chance?

JACKEY: Well, there's got to be some individuals out there who are on a path, but they just haven't seen, they haven't found the right light to go towards yet.

THERRY: And therein lies the hope of the species.

JACKEY: That each one of those have to be attended as individually one to one.

THERRY: Yes. Those who are inwardly realizing that there's got to be more than this mass bullshit, on an individual basis they will flounder for who knows how long, but they will learn.

CORA: Because they're starting the process of seeking?


CORA: So before you can seek, you have to realize that something's wrong, and once they see something's wrong, they leave all this maybe organized stuff, even if they maybe get into like witchcraft, different things, they'll eventually come to a point where they may meet a guide, for instance?


CORA: Because you can't get something that you're not looking for.

THERRY: Right.

CORA: But in the process, depending on what they find, they can do themselves a lot of harm as well.

THERRY: Who cares in the long run so long as they learn.

CORA: Now from another level, you once said something about it does matter how many lights, lamps are lit, or how many people are studying with the light because in the world of duality, there's a balance, and so even if one person changes their heart, you said that it makes a difference in the species as a whole.


CORA: Now how does that work?

THERRY: Because you're looking at the potential for the species.

CORA: So if you add one new light, you could say that the species is getting better.

THERRY: Is evolved, right.

CORA: So in that case every single person would matter, and what they do.

THERRY: Of course.

CORA: Even if the species as a whole doesn't listen to teachers, or is bemused by illusion, the mass illusion.

THERRY: Of course, but you've changed levels now.

DUNCAN: That's the problem; I never know what level you're coming on, I never know what level I'm thinking on; I'm always switching.


DUNCAN: Half the time I never know what--

THERRY: Yep, that's the level of truth.

CORA: So the key is to learn how to figure out what level you're on.

THERRY: Yes. And don't cross your levels, `cause each level has its own respective set of, or subset of law. Each level has its own demands, its own expectations.

CORA: And yet within reality, everything's a fabric, so all those levels interact, right?


CORA: So when you're in a situation, how do you know which level of truth to follow?

THERRY: That's where wisdom comes in, and that's where Maat guides you.

CORA: That's where it depends on your value system?


CORA: And whether you're going to choose say, honor, or the fulfillment of need--


CORA: --or say something else.


DUNCAN: So when we have conversations, it's referenced to a common reality unless somebody says differently?


CORA: Well, within the conversation you generally reference it to a certain level, or the person does by their question. If you go back--I guess that's why taping things is good because you can go back and pick out from the conversation what--

THERRY: That's not always so because a lot of times he who questions has something in his mind that is not on the tape.

CORA: Oh, okay.

THERRY: And that leads to an implication which gets back to illusions.

CORA: So you'd have to learn to be very explicit in your communication in order to so accurate so someone else that hears the tape could get the correct information, right?


JACKEY: What is the connection between the Maat and the mind? I mean, is the mind where Maat resides?

THERRY: No. Let's see if I can answer that in a different way. The mind has an ability to think. He has to have some means to guide his thoughts.

JACKEY: You mean the human does.

THERRY: Yes. The mind. There are a number of scales that he can use. If he chooses a scale that is for the betterment of the species, that is his Maat. If he uses a scale that is for the betterment of himself and fuck the species, that is his Maat. That is his scale of reference, that is his axioms. That's going to be the Royal Steering Current of his life's experience. Does that answer your question? Okay, let's see if I can try a different one. Let me enter your mind. Okay, it's a set of reference points that you use to compare things with. It's what helps you determine what is right and what is wrong.

JACKEY: Okay, now I understand what Maat. I guess what I was asking was what's the medium in which it exists in us in our physical form.

THERRY: No, it's not a medium, it's a scale of reference. It's an evaluation in terms of what is appropriate and what is not.

JACKEY: Okay, I understand that. I mean, like, in our minds we talk to ourselves--

THERRY: Yes according to specific values.

JACKEY: Are we communicating with Maat?

THERRY: According to specific values.

JACKEY: Right, but that's Maat.

THERRY: Maat is what helps you understand to place values on things. Like if you're a businessman, you have to know how much you should charge for your wears. Well, you use Maat in order to apply a value to something.

JACKEY: Okay, I understand that. I think I was getting more at the way we communicate with Maat in our physical bodies.

THERRY: You don't communicate with Maat; you only communicate with yourself. Maat is simply a system you use to place value on other things.

JACKEY: When we communicate with ourselves, and we have say, this conversation with this small voice within us, isn't that small voice kind of the spokesman for Maat?


CLARK : Is Maat the axiom?


CLARK : Now, those axioms can change over time.

THERRY: According to Karma.

JACKEY: That voice gets biased by the leader now, doesn't it?

THERRY: Yes. Psychological screens. The voice gets biased.

JACKEY: That inner voice that you communicate with biased by your illusion.